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QUESTIONS & ANSWERS:
Questions or Comments Welcomed!
Comment or Question #37
If you want to pass my email
on I can be some help to others about the black widow.
Comment or Question #36
Hello, I want to double check on one fact. Are you absolutely certain the 57 Chevy car used for stock car racing came from the factory in other colors besides black and white?
Did any of the SEDCO cars arrive with any other color scheme?
The S.E.D.C.O. cars were all painted black & white. They might have arrived there in other colors. The “Competition Guide” shows the black & white only. I’m sure the 1957 Chev. Competition car was race in other colors, but the nickname “Black Widow” wouldn’t have applied
It’s known fact the 1957 Chev. Competition car wasn’t assembled for racing on a factory assembly line.
Let me know if this helps.
Comment or Question #35
Q. I really want to thank you, Bev and Scott, for the tremendous amount of effort and documentation you shared with us Chevy lovers on your project's development from start to finish.
This project is the best I've ever observed on the internet. What an education! Super photography.
I'm 63 yrs old and have a '57. Your documentation will help me make the right moves to re-finish my pride and joy '57 as I enter retirement.
A. Hi Tom,
Thank you for your kind words of encouragement. Best of luck on the project.
Comment or Question #34
web site! I didn't see any pics of the distributor. Did the '57 use the
window-type distributor, starting that year in the passenger cars, or did
it use a special dual-point?
A. Hi Ben,
The “Black Widow” used a dual point, full centrifugal advance distributor. No vacuum or window type.
Comment or Question #33
Q. Several years ago I read an article about the SEDCO cars in a magazine. Unfortunately I don't remember which one. Two things I remember and need to be confirmed:
1) there were drag race versions of these cars. One was found in the 90's in a falling down shed. It had been to drag raced and the original SEDCO NASCAR parts were with it.
2) the fenders of the NASCAR versions had a household A/C grill riveted to the outside of the fender to vent pressure under the wheel wells. A recent release of a 1/25th scale model kit of this car doesn't have the grill. I haven't researched for pictures from '57 but you might want to investigate.
A. Hi Gary,
The one you saw from the falling down shed was one of two test mule cars assembled at S.E.D.C.O.. Later in its life it was converted to a drag racer.
The original F.I. cars fell out of power at 80 M.P.H.. On the test mules the under hood pressure was making the F.I. system confused and when they cut out the fenders to relieve the pressure the system ran better.
The F.I. cars ran one race only and from then on had to run a single 380 C.M.F. four barrel. They no longer needed the cut out fenders.
They continued to race them with the fuel injection logo even though they had single four barrels. The carburetored engines were much faster anyway. Let me know if I can be of further help.
Comment or Question #32
Q. Hello, My name is Gregory Gunn. I am a 1/43 scale model builder. I am working on making a Black Widow model in 1/43 scale. I made one before and sold it to a race car historian in Florida. Do you think there would be a market for these if I have a mould made from it and produce 50 or so? The cost would be about 150.00ea.boxed and serial numbered. Were these only in black and white?. The one I made was light blue and white. I have a picture of it and would be glad to e-mail it to you. I would have to take a picture of a picture to get it. These would be resin cast. Let me know your thoughts. Regards Gregory Gunn
A. Hi Gregory,
Only black and whites were nicknamed “Black Widow”, of course other colors were also raced.
On “e-bay” there are “Black Widow” models at various prices. Yours sounds unique and should have a good market. Model collectors should be interested.
I would like to see your picture of it.
Comment or Question #31
Q. Thanks for the reply, one other question as far as value from one of the originals and one that was fabricated. Glenn
A. Hi Glenn,
Individuals and groups of individuals assembled these according to the "Guide"
The most talked about ones were assembled by the S.E.D.C.O. group in Atlanta, Georgia. The value of the remaining ones would most likely be unlimited. There are no records of how many were assembled.
Check my “Known Facts” section on my “Home Page”.
I hope this will be helpful.
Comment or Question #30
Q. Were all of what is know as the black widow black and white in color. Thanks Glenn
Comment or Question #29
You have a really great
web site. I didn't see this mentioned any where on the site. And you
probably know anyway, but just in case you don't. Richard Childress owns
an original 1957 Chevy Black Widow with, believe it or not, only twelve
miles on it. There is a small article in the September issue of NASCAR
Comment or Question #28
I want to thank you for
posting the many pictures of old guy Scott's restoration. Maybe I should
have said racetoration. Anyway it took me several hours to view them all
but it was worth it. Tell Scott that he did a fantastic job. I hope he
gets to enjoy it. Brian in Nashville
Comment or Question #27
Comment or Question #26
Would you ask Old Guy
which vehicle the wheels he used came off of?? The Guide gives the correct
part number and I know they were 15x6 6 lug but what vehicle did they come
from?? Also did he use 710x15 or 760 x15 tires??
Comment or Question #25
Here are the pictures of the 1957 Chevrolet 150 Fuel Injected 2dr sedan I recently finished.. I sold the car to a fellow In Wyoming.. The pictures were taken at my shop in Olympia..
This car was NOT done as a NASCAR tribute but rather as you could have ordered from your Chevy dealer.. It had 5 lug suspension.. Full 283 /283 HP ..second series fuel injector., 12/18 lash solid lifter cam ,correct 57 motor heads ,3 speed overdrive with 4.10 posi..Very nice car.. I miss the car .
.That's why I am building the full NASCR tribute.. I have the project going ..Motor is being freshened up, heads are being done with swirl polished valves and hard seats,car is heading for the sand blaster on Monday.. I have all the 6lug front and rear suspension.., the big gas tank , the big radiator, the extra cross members etc.Lots of fab to do ..Your pictures of the OLD GUY s project will be very helpful
Thanks, Roger Sanford
A. Hi Roger,
I received your terrific pictures and know “Black Widow” fans will like them too! Thank you for the pictures I will put them in the photo album. Let me know the progress on your new build.
Comment or Question #24
I am building a 57 150
chev Black widow ..full tribute NASCAR..Fuel injection 283/283 HP..
Comment or Question #23
Hello, We have a car of
the month feature, if you would like to submit A story on the black widow
for car of month let me know.
“Old Guy Scott” has been
building the Black Widow” everyday for two years and I know he won’t stop
until it’s finished. The other cars in his collection bare this out. He is
letting me do these updates as he continues along. I asked “Old Guy Scott”
if I could video this car as well as his others, they are unique from the
ground up and all are show pieces,
Comment or Question #22
Q. Bev, thanks for calling my attention to the carb modification. Things just happen. I have a neat article on the black widow, over 4 pages , "musclecars" September 1980. Great article and pictures. I'd be happy to send it to you if you tell me how and where. Thanks, clayton williams
Thanks for the info. All articles on the “Black Widow” are important. I have the issue you mentioned, and it’s great to see the car featured on the cover too. All information is welcome and needed.
Comment or Question #21
I spoke with Bradley Dennis yesterday.
Comment or Question #20
Q. Hello, can you find out from Scott what carbs and manifold he's using on the bw? Thanks
Go to the building a tribute link and click on update #10. Photo’s #110 & 111 show how he modified the manifold for carbs. Be sure to click on the photos to enlarge them. Update#18 shows how to make a single air cleaner if you prefer. Let me know if you need other details.
Comment or Question #19
Q. Who were the mechanics on the SEDCO team? I know about the Clements brothers and Bradley Dennis, but I want to know about Paul McDuffie. Can you confirm his role on the team?
A. Hi Tommy,
Don’t have that info. Mike Clements dad and uncle were the Clements brothers on the SEDCO team. I’m told Mike knows his stuff. Mike Clements Racing Engines. http://www.heartbeatracingproducts.com/ Phone 480-503-2337
Does anyone have info on this car???
Q. I`m in North San Diego County. About 15 years ago, Ben Anderson (HME Restorations) built a very high quality Black Widow for John, I believe his last name was Kolb. This was shown at several Classic Chevy shows and always scored very high. John later moved to Florida and I heard he had passed away. Do you know what happened to that car??
It was first shown in a preview at Weshlow Chevrolet in Carlsbad, CA. I may have some photos from that event.
It had number 47 on the doors Fuel Injection on the front fenders and 283 HP in the hood.
email webmaster if you have any info on this.
Comment or Question #17
Q. Bev: My engine number is T0507GF (GF=FI so documentation tells me) but there also is an engine id that ends with EK. What's the difference? Thanks, Tony
A. Hi Tony. According to my book the block casting numbers, (up top by distributor, and crank case vent tube) need to be 3731548. The cyl. heads need to be 3731539 for the 283 F.I. solid lifter.
You may want to call Danchuk Mfg. Co. in Los Angeles to find out what your your vin- numbers are. Contact me any time if you need more help, good luck.
Comment or Question #16
have a 57 BelAir, 3 speed on column, Fuel injection block, no fuel
injection as it was converted to carburetion. Did they make an FI 3 speed
A. The 283 horsepower F.I. engines in the passenger car line were all 3 speed column shifts. The 250 horsepower F.I. were powerglide and 3 speed column shift. Good luck on your project.
Comment or Question #15
did Old Scott get the bar that runs along his rear diff? I'm talking
about the one that kinda looks like a sway bar. Did he make it or can I
buy one somewhere?
A. Hi Joe,
I contacted “Old Guy Scott” and he says, most ”Black Widows” used a rear end support bar, much like a modern off road vehicle. In road racing trim, “Old Guy Scott” uses the sway bar, this leaves no room for the support bar. Hellwig Products Co. Inc. Phone 559-734-7451 in Visalia, Ca. made the rear sway bar for 1957 Chevy. “Old Guy Scott” had to modify the side bolt setup with ¼ in plates to support this bolt for serious duty.
Comment or Question #14
Good afternoon, I have a couple of
questions for you. I've always been a 57 fan, ever since my dad had a body
shop when I was a kid, im currently serving in the United States Marine
Corps at Camp Fallujah Iraq. Why this info is important is because even
though 13 months in the desert is never fun, I've saved up enough money to
buy my dream car. I have found someone who claims to have one of the 22
original Black Widows. He is doing a complete off the frame restoration
right now, and has offered to sell it to me with little hesitation. How do
I know for sure if this is the real deal? What should I look out for, and
do you have any suggestions for my situation or the restoration it's self?
A. Sgt. McDonald,
Comment or Question #13
Hello, I actually have two questions. 1) who authored the 57 competition
A. Hi John,
“The Old Guy Scott” has one of the original competition guide booklets, there were four hundred and eleven sent to Chevrolet Dealerships. Now you can easily obtain reproductions of this very important guide. These were originally produced by Chevrolet Central Office, Div. of Gen. Mtr. Corp. Detroit 2, Michigan. They were sent to all Chevrolet Dealerships by R.D. Lund National Sales Promotion Manager. Chevrolet NEVER manufactured the “Black Widow”. The one fifty, two door sedan was recommended by Chevrolet, because of its light weight. “Black Widows” did not roll off any of Chevrolets production lines.
It seems people have a hard time shaking the myth that Chevrolet made” Black Widows”
Southern Engineering and Development Corp. was established as a division of Nally Chevrolet, Atlanta, Georgia. Chevrolet Engineers helped to establish this short lived group. Their production number is unknown. The individual Competition Guide cars were looked upon as “Black Widows”, wherever they were assembled. ( The “John Q Public” gave them that nick name). The Guide listed all parts, numbers, and instructions to assemble your own racing stock car.
I hope this can clear it up some, let me know.
Comment or Question #12
My name is Dan and I own a 1957 Chevy 2 door post utility sedan or business man coupe.
Do you have any idea where I can get the original wooden panels for the back seat area or information, I have looked almost everywhere.
A. Hi Dan,
I checked with “Old Guy Scott”, he says check out “Super Chevy” magazine, November 1995.
On page 38 Bill Ulrich of Manheim, Pennsylvania built a utility 150 2dr F.I. from scratch. He might be a great source of information.
On page 70, same issue, Bob Flak of Pioneer Classic Autos, Phoenix Az. Built a “Black Widow” tribute, and has a restoration business.
Don’t have phone numbers, hopefully you could track down this information.
I would like photos of your project for the website.
Comment or Question #11
Thanks! So 1955-59 truck...do these have the 10-bolt covers like in Old
Guy Scott's photos? I thought there were no removable covers on those
trucks' housings (like the cars). Maybe I am wrong on that...I hope I am.
A. Joe, “Old Guy Scott” says they not only have the large reinforced rear cover, but also unbolt from the front, so the center section with the gearing can be easily changed. The rear cover must be removed first, because the axles are the “C” clip design and must slip outward in order to remove the front, which is the entire gear assembly. Not like the car at all.
DANCHUK has original type radiators. The rings on the inside of the radiator have to be made and installed yourself. The large fin count is for speedways and the small fin count is for dirt track. Each racer could choose to use this fan protection or not.
Comment or Question #10
I'm having trouble figuring out which year truck the 1/2 rear differential
came from...weren't most torque tube setups?
A. Joe, I checked with “Old Guy Scott” and he says, the torque tube was used in 1954 and on down in years. The “Black Widow” uses ½ ton 1955 thru 1959, these are open drive shaft differentials. The early updates show how they were modified for the car. Don’t forget you need to shorten the drive shaft approximately one and one quarter inches. This rear end is bigger and wider. Don’t hesitate to let me know if you need more info.
Comment or Question #9
C. Hi, My 57 I painted with a fresh coat of Dupont dcc concept urethane pitch black and white combination , will be cutting and buffing next week ,polishing stainless trim and reassembling .. also enclosed some pics of the 2x4 wcfb combination that came with the car ...I am putting gasket kits in the carbs and going thru them... keep up the great site >>>Scott
A. I asked “Old Guy Scott” about the picture of number 47. It was a SEDCO Black Widow driven to fifth in the point standings by Jack Smith.
Glad to see your “Black Widow” progressing so well. “Old Guy Scott” says if your W.C.F.B. Carter carbs flood out on hard “left” turns, he knows the cure, if you need it.
Thanks for your updated pictures. Will post them on the website. Look forward to more.
“Black Widows forever”
Comment or Question #8Q. Hello, I own 6-57 Chevy's 2 conv (Basket cases) 2-2dr Ht's
1-Bel Air 2dr.sedan(Patriotic) 1-Bel air 4dr. wagon( was in a barn since 1970 just picked it up 2 Yrs ago, All original unmolested. Needs some work but runs and drives. I am planning on doing a Blackwidow Clone in the future and a Elmorocco clone. I have 2 sets of Fenton Headers for a small block and was wondering if the real Blackwidows had these headers with no names on them or did they all run the Rams Horn Manifolds. Thanks and I will be checking back on Your Cool Website. Thanks, Dave
A. The “Black Widows” assembled by S.E.D.C.O. (Southern Engineering and Development Company), used a special made exhaust manifold made by Fenton. They were tubular cast and went from the cylinder head. Including header pipe, to the back of the rear motor mount horns. These were extremely long and had “FENTON” cast between the front two cylinders. Other groups or individuals that assembled their “Black Widows” may or may not have used them. The competition guide, on pages ten and twenty show the ram horn set up. The “Old Guy Scott” said he will use the two and a half inch ram horn. If you build your car according to the “1957 Stock Car Competition Guide”, it would be a “tribute car” to the “Black Widow” of fifty years ago. The “Black Widows” were individually made and did not come off an assembly line, the “Guide” shows how this competition car should be built. Of the one hundred and seventy parts listed for this special car, the manifolds aren’t listed!
Thank you for your interest and for the nice photos. When you have your tribute car under way please send photos and I will post them in the album.
Comment or Question #7
Q. I have a 57 Chevy 150 that I am making a Black Widow Clone. I am almost done all I have left is to put in the rubber floor and remove the back seat I put in for my kids. I need to know where to place the fuel injection scripts and flags. I would like to place them in the exact same place as the factory did.
Mine has a hot rod 283 w/4bbl muncie m-21 4.11 posi and is painted with the PPG deep black. Also does it have to be black and white? mine is all black and the wife hates the two tone black and white. She refuses to let me white the trunk and quarter panels.
Any help would be very much appreciated. I sent a pic in case you would like to see it
All original "Black Widows" were black and white, as you mentioned. Your car is so nice it would be a a shame to get the color package wrong, any "Black Widow" fan will tell you the same. Memory of the greatest stock car in history is very important.
I will place your "Black Widow" tribute car in the photo album section. If you decide to change the color combination, please send a new photo.
Comment or Question #6
C. Restoration project underway plan on putting the dual wcfb carbs on soon ..... it is now in the paint shop came with 57 truck rear end and dual mounted rear shocks... car came out of North Carolina. I recently acquired a 3 speed trans car had been converted to an automatic turbo paint code says (sp) car at one time had a roll bar floor pans had hole cut in them love your site Scott................
Hi Scott Davies,
Comment or Question #5
Comment. Nice web site and look forward to seeing more as it develops.
Here is some fuel for the fire....
My '57 150 Black Widow tribute ride. Of course it's not the real deal but damn nice anyway. Enjoy!
The historic photos are from Mike Clements. The Clements Bros. (Mike's Dad and Uncle) were part of the original Black Widow pit crew and Mike grew up right in the action. Better google Mike, he knows his stuff!
Good luck, you have my permission to post photos and thank you for keeping the REAL NASCAR history alive.
Comment or Question #4
Q. how many were made . heard 10 for nascar 50 for drag?
heard that a frames were boxed with flat metal for extra strength?
smaller pulleys on generators because of higher rpm's?
where did 6 hole hubs come from? some one told me from checker others say pickup?
dual shocks in rear?
did they have finned valve covers or scripted stock ones?
heard they had trouble with air pressure under the hood?
did they have vacuum pumps from pickups?
did they have electric wipers?
(B). Flat metal boxed the lower "A" frames and front frame horn supports, on top. Five cross members V.S. two on the production cars. (Check the "Old Guys" tribute).
(C). Larger pulley to slow gen. for high R.P.M. Also deeper belt groove. Competition part #3711766.
(D). Six bolt wheels were six inches wide, the half ton pick-up's were five and five and a half. The entire rear end was half ton pick-up, (Check the "Old Guys" tribute).
(E). All used four rear shocks, some used sway bar for road course racing, some used two inch lowering blocks, (Check the "Old Guys" tribute).
(F). Scripted stock only.
(G). Air pressure under the hood was a problem for Fuel Injected only, (Barometric Pressure caused F.I. to malfunction above eighty M.P.H.). Smokey Yunich's suggestion to cut front fenders out at the top in rear portion solved the problem on "Test Mule".
(H). Vacuum pumps were special "Guide" item for big cam engines with low vacuum. Especially F.I. engines.
(I). All competition 150's were suppose to use R.P.O. #320 (electric wipers).
Thanks for your interest. Bev
Comment or Question #3
Great information. Is the
competition guide still available for purchase? I just bought a Utility
Sedan and was thinking of making a modified version of the black widow. I
have located a 283 fuel-injection motor. Lou
Comment or Question #2
Great website. The 1957 chevy used for the black
widow was a 150 "Utility Sedan". There was only 8,300 Utility Sedans made
in 57. The utility sedan differed from the 150 sedan in that it had no back
seat and the back windows didn't roll down. The 150 Utilitly Sedan was also
called the "Business Coupe". Without the back seat, sales people could put
their products in the back of the car. Please keep up the website. This is
going to be a very good classic site.
A. Thank you for your input.
The competition guide from the factory says, on page four, “The versatile one-fifty utility sedan model 1512 is a popular choice, and is essentially a two door sedan without rear seat. An alternate is the regular one-fifty two door sedan model 1502. Either model is adaptable to regular stock car competition”. On page fifteen, the “Guide” shows their Black Widow has roll up rear side windows, must be model 1502.
I talked to “Old Guy” Scott and he said the rear seat will slip in or out when modified in this manner for those who want to street drive.
Comment or Question #1
Q. Your site appears to be new. Is it? Please keep it updated because it looks like Old Guy Scott's build will be helpful to guys like me who don't have a clue as to how to do these mods! Would Scott be interested in producing any of his mods to sell? Or maybe sell detailed instructions or guide booklet? It may be something to consider because there is little to no info on the way to do these mods. Thanks for your time and keep up the good work!
Thanks and have a great day! Eric
Your suggestions sound good. Thanks for your interest. Bev